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SilatIndonesia.Com

Author Topic: Keris in Silat  (Read 22214 times)

Russian Silat

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Re: Keris in Silat
« Reply #45 on: 06/01/2008 05:08 »
Hello Mr. Bram,

Again I have to thank you for your informative post.

This orgasmic ngurek of which you speak- is this really an accurate description of the goals and aims of the Ilmu?

Also, do you consider that Balinese Keris knowledge is representative of older Javanese culture, or that Keris and kujang traditions there have no such connections?

Best Regards,

Russian Silat

Ranggalana

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Re: Keris in Silat
« Reply #46 on: 06/01/2008 07:07 »
You are welcome, Mr. Walls...

I don't think ngurek has anything to do with ilmu. Seen the 'keris dance' in film or real life when the dancers go into trance and try and stab themselves with keris? This is called ngurek, they say it means that ancestor spirits have come and that they are being cleansed. These trances often happen in temple ceremonies and in the performance of real Calonarang theatre. 

There is a connection between Balinese keris and old Jawanese keris culture, but I believe the two have always been independent of each other. To understand Jawa keris you need to study Jawa keris and vice versa. Again, the Calonarang theatre will help explain the ancient connections between Jawa and Bali that per-date Majapahit.

Whilst kujang, as I said, I see a very long period when the blade was completely dormant. It is the most mysterious blade we have in Indonesia.

Warm regards,
Ranggalana
batu kali jadi candi, duka jadi puisi, jagal jadi wali

EricB

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Re: Keris in Silat
« Reply #47 on: 06/01/2008 11:44 »
Mas Krisno I'm not censoring at all, I'm not a member of the Gestapo ;)
I just want to prevent that people are stepping on eachothers feet again.

This is indeed a public environment, that's why it must be inviting to outsiders to participate, if there is only argument and/or off-topic chit-chat people won't be triggered to participate. If that happens maybe we miss valuable input from people with knowledge.

My personal believe is also not in question, I try to be neutral in this matter, I'm also a member of this forum and I like it here a lot, but as moderator I'll have an effort to guide the discussion.

Don't take it personal Mas, I know and I noticed everyone in this thread added positive value, and that is good [top] my respect

Wassalam,


James Z

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Re: Keris in Silat
« Reply #48 on: 07/01/2008 00:31 »
Hello everyone,

Bram, you called me a liar before but I have to say I agree with you now, this talk should stay on message.  And that message being kris fighting in silat.  Am glad to see the moderators being even handed.  My hats off to Eric for being positive and keeping the talk on point.  I'm also glad to read Krisno's words again.  I think he's very evenhanded. I think he presents the other side in a way that is understood and accepted.  As an American with an interest in Silat and some experience in Indonesia, I'm glad to see Indonesians are being more accepting of Americans.  I've heard a few tales of Indonesians being jealous of foreigners who are good at silat.  I've heard a few more tales of Indonesians that downright hate foreigners who are better at silat then them.  When I first found this website, I assumed that's was the reason why so many Indonesians seemed to hate Sanders so much, he was better at Silat than them.  I see now that it's not that Indonesians hate him, but that they want to correct him.  Thanks to PCP for showing everyong  that they do know what they are talkinga bout.  I hope that now Americans and Indoensians can move forward in brotherhood and stop bickering.  the bickering gives a bad impression.  When I first found this website, i was so turned off by the bickering that I almost lost interest in learning silat.  Thank you to everyone for renewing my faith.

Jim
« Last Edit: 07/01/2008 00:34 by James Z »

Ranggalana

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Re: Keris in Silat
« Reply #49 on: 07/01/2008 06:57 »
James,

There is still some uncleared controversy in the way PCP play with the keris and tell people that they are teaching Jawanese techniques.

This is highly unlikely.

The words of alm. Jafri quoted by Sanders (Tikam Tunggal) point to a Malay source, not a Jawa source.

Salam hangat,
Ranggalana

batu kali jadi candi, duka jadi puisi, jagal jadi wali

Angah

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Re: Keris in Silat
« Reply #50 on: 31/08/2008 06:24 »
Dear Sahabats,

about using the keris in Silat, I'll only can tell about my experience as a member from SMKL9
Silat Melayu Keris Lok 9. I have met Guru Azlan Ghanie in 1999 in Kuala Lumpur and since that time I started with training SMKL9 till now. The Style we do is from palace (Pahang wariors).
and using the bugis keris. The difference between bugis and javanese is the peksi and the thikness of the blade. I've also learn a mix of Javanese alirans but we never trained with keris. In Malaysia the keris is more involved with silat then in Indonesia. In the Human Weapon you see some peaces of this beautyfull art. Using the keris is based on a lot of petua it's not just a weapon, you must feel to understand. I'm only can say experience the feeling and you know what I mean.

Hormat Saya
Angah

EricB

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Re: Keris in Silat
« Reply #51 on: 31/08/2008 15:16 »
Hello Angah,

I'm happy to see you've become a member on this forum also
please share your experience with us,
I know the use of Keris in Malay silat systems is more common then in Indonesian silat systems.


well guys lets continue this discussion

Ranggalana

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Re: Keris in Silat
« Reply #52 on: 04/09/2008 06:13 »
The angle of the blade in relation to the handle, and the handle itself,  is also different between the Bugis / Malay keris and the Jawa keris. In the Bugis keris the angle is more so that the blade can be held in a pistol grip and slipped through an opponent's ribs.

Angah, please elaborate more on the feeling of the keris and it's use in silat.

Salam hangat,
batu kali jadi candi, duka jadi puisi, jagal jadi wali

Anjang

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Re: Keris in Silat
« Reply #53 on: 05/09/2008 18:26 »
Salam abang Angah! Good to see you on this forum also.  [top]

Hormat saya, Anjang
--
Anjang (Leon Gubbels)

Angah

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Re: Keris in Silat
« Reply #54 on: 29/09/2008 13:50 »
Terhormat Pesilats,

Well in Silat Melayu Keris Lok 9, there are a lot of petua's. If you know the petua's and your movements and the nafas melayu are in harmony you feel a lot of energy. The last visit in Malaysia we trained a lot Senanam Tua and Keris Lok 9 and the feeling was great the pesilat from Belanda had a lot of energy so the can't sleep before 5 p.m. and wake up 8 o clock in the morning everyday.The feeling is sensational, but I can write for 2 hours but if you never have the experience I cant explain the right feeling. Believe in the art of keris.

PS. He Adik Anjang yes I'm on the air ;-)

 

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